He Will Do Everything When There Is Need
(Srila Prabhupada as a grhastha hearing from Srila Bhaktisiddhanta, Radha-Kunda, 1935)

Prabhupāda: All these things are, they are simply māyā. Māyā-sukhāya bharam udvahato vimūḍhān (SB 7.9.43). These rascal, they are working so hard, making gorgeous arrangement. For what? For illusory sense gratification. That sense gratification is also false. Real sense gratification is in Kṛṣṇa and kṛṣṇa-dhāma. Hlādinī, sandhinī, saṁvit, perverted in this material life. Āhlāda-tapa-kārī miśrayate tair na guṇa-varjite. Here āhlāda, pleasure, and tapa-kārī, pain, and mixture of āhlāda. This is the position. Tair na guṇa-varjite.

This kind of pleasure is not in Kṛṣṇa, guṇa-varjite, because He is free from the material contamination. So anyway, the human life is only meant for... this is our mission, to teach that "You are simply wasting your time. Take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness." That is his only business. And next business is, those who cannot directly take to, then those, they should be helping this movement. Therefore we go door to door, to connect them, to be linked up with this movement, Life Member, this member, that member... They are misunderstanding, "They have no other good business. Transcendental fraud, giving us some book and taking money and eating and sleeping. They have got..." They are thinking like that.

Devotee: So we should preach strongly, and they should know that we also preach.

Prabhupāda: Yes. They should know that it is for their benefit we are making them Life Member, not for our benefit. And that should be the motive.

Devotee: They should give with that motive.

Prabhupāda: Yes. We should deal with them so that they may develop their Kṛṣṇa consciousness. If you simply make it a point, somehow or other, take some money from them and let them go to hell, that is not... that is transcendental fraud. What do you think, Gargamuni?

Gargamuni: Yes. We have to preach.

Prabhupāda: Yes. If by the dress of sannyāsī you take some money and eat and sleep, then it is transcendental fraud. (laughs)... (indistinct Hindi) ... Just like others are toiling, and we are getting money by some dress. That's all. They are getting money by laboring hard, and we are getting money... in India, mostly the sannyāsīs, they do that. The priests also, they do that. "This is our profession." Just... my Guru Mahārāja said that ṭhākura dekhiye paisa rojgar karache, rastaye jhnat jīvika uparpan kora bhalo. Instead of earning livelihood by showing the Deity in the temple, it is better to take the profession of a sweeper in the street and live honestly. He said like that.

The sweeper, he is working hard, toiling, and getting some money and living. This is honest living. But just like in Vṛndāvana, all the gosvāmīs, they have got their Deity. People are coming, contributing… Ṭhākura dekhiye paisa rojgar kora. All the sevaites, they are meant for... our Kunja Babu also planned like that. He thought, "By cheating all the Godbrothers, I have got now Caitanya Maṭha. And people will come to see Caitanya Mahāprabhu's birthplace, and I will get good income. And it will be distributed amongst my brothers and sons and myself. That's all." That is his scheme.

Devotee: Perfect material plan.

Prabhupāda: Yes. It is another way of earning money. And he was always after Guru Mahārāja only for this purpose. Guru Mahārāja took that "Oh, this man is helping me." But he had no such plan, to help Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī. He had the plan, "Keep Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī in front, earn money, and put it in my pocket." That was his very beginning. He was taking money like anything. But he was a good manager. Other Godbrothers complained, sannyāsīs. Guru Mahārāja used to say that, "Why you are complaining? You cannot reform him, your Godbrother? And if I would have to keep expert manager like him, I would have to pay something. Suppose he is taking something. Why do you grudge?" (laughs) He would say like that. So nobody could say anything. But after the demise, everything burst out: "Kunja Babu must be driven out." That was the whole plan of Gauḍīya Maṭha breakdown. The grudge was against Kunja Babu.

Devotee: Who is Kunja Babu?

Prabhupāda: That Tīrtha Mahārāja.

Devotee: Oh, Tīrtha Mahārāja.

Prabhupāda: His name is Kunja Vihari Sar. So that was boiling in everyone's heart. So as soon as Guru Mahārāja passed away, so that burst out. And the whole plan was how to get out this Kunja Babu.

Devotee: Not how to preach.

Prabhupāda: No. This was the cause of breakdown. This was suppressed by Guru Mahārāja under his influence, but the rebellious was there during his lifetime. And it burst into... therefore he advised that, "You make a governing body, and Kunja Babu should be allowed to remain manager." This was directly spoken. He never asked anybody to become ācārya. He asked that, "You form a governing body of twelve men and go on preaching, and Kunja Babu may be allowed to remain manager during his lifetime."

He never said that Kunja Babu should be ācārya. None, none of them were advised by Guru Mahārāja to become ācārya. His idea was "Let them manage; then whoever will be actual qualified for becoming ācārya, they will elect. Why I should enforce upon them?" That was his plan. "Let them manage by strong governing body, as it is going on. Then ācārya will come by his qualification." But they wanted that... because at heart, they were, "After demise of Guru, I shall become ācārya," "I shall become ācārya." So all the ācāryas began fight. One side, that Vāsudeva Ācārya and Sar Kunja Babu Ācārya. And Paramānanda, he thought that "Whoever will be powerful, I shall join them." (laughing) He only thought. But Guru Mahārāja never asked that these three men should be trustees. He wanted governing body.

So the rebellion broke out immediately after his passing away. And then fight in the high court. And Kunja Babu, from the... he is very intelligent man. So from the very beginning he knew that "There will be fight after the demise of Guru Mahārāja. So fight will be in the high court. So at the expense of Guru Mahārāja, let my brother and sons become attorneys and barrister so I will have not to pay for these things." It was a planned thing. And that is being done. He was a clerk; it was not in his power to make his brother and sons attorneys and barristers. They were all made at the cost of Gauḍīya Maṭha to fight with... (indistinct) ... Mahārāja in favor of Tīrtha Mahārāja. These were the planned things. But I was a rotten gṛhastha. I did not join any one of them. (laughs) I was rotting in my household life, that's all.

But I was planning how to make, how to make this. That was my desire from the very beginning, since I heard it. But that I was never with them, either this party or that party. And Guru Mahārāja also recommended, apnader kach theke ektu dure thakai bhalo. Takhon... dorkar thakbe aami nijei korbo... "When there will be need, he will do himself. There is no need of living with you. It is better to live apart from you." When I was recommended by Goswami Mahārāja to live in the Maṭha, that "He is so nice... (indistinct) ..." he recommended, in Bombay, here in this Bombay. That house. Yes. He (Guru Mahārāja) said: "Yes, he is very expert. He can do. So it is better to live apart from you. And he will do everything when there is need." He said. I could not understand. Although I was apart from them, a gṛhastha. In this Bombay I was doing business. (people talking outside) Yes?

Gargamuni: The man is here.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes, let them come.

Indian lady: ... (indistinct Hindi)

(Srila Prabhupada Conversation, Bombay, September 21, 1973)

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